Switch 2018

General Discussions
felix
Posts: 544
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:24 pm

Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:47 pm

Moving forward into the future.

Yes we are working on new designs. We can not give you a E.T.A or spill to much as we don't want to over promise like before.
All our current designs are rocking and like any thing with time will evolve .

Being fortunate enough I have tested all our past proto designs and all our designs going forward. Giving me a very good hands on experience with a lot of kites even steaming to all the other brands out there.
No better way .

I can validate that a good surf kite will work very well on the foil. Due to the fact you are looking for the same drift characteristics.
This is why our Element5 works pretty well for this.

Lot of people get fascinated on number or struts - sure this makes a difference - Jerome you are very correct on your finding on the type of kites you have listed.

Moving forward in our design criteria we want to have kites that double over into different styles so you are not just stuck with one kite that does only one thing very well.

For example. - Nitro boosts and is also a nice kite for bump and jump
Element5 - waves and foil
Helium - Light air - light wind foil and free ride.
Legacy2 is our only speciality kite for wake.
JeromeD
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:05 pm

Sat Nov 18, 2017 12:51 am

JeromeD wrote:I would buy a 12/9/7/5 equivalent quiver (covers same wind range as Elements in same sizes) for foiling. 9 and 7 seem to be the goto size in South Padre Island with an occasional 5 thrown in. I however always seem to need a kite size bigger. I frequently fly a 12m Naish Trip strutless that becomes a handful when the wind picks up as it does not fly well when significantly depowered. My other foiling kite is a Cloud 9m with which I have a love/hate relationship. I'm not a fan of strutless kites in general as they tend to be ill behaved in gusty conditions and hard to relaunch. I would like the kite in the biggest size to still fly in 10mph so I can limp home if required.

How will these kites perform in the surf? A lot of the other brands, including the Airush Ultra, claim they are good surf kites as well.
felix wrote:I can validate that a good surf kite will work very well on the foil. Due to the fact you are looking for the same drift characteristics.
This is why our Element5 works pretty well for this.
Felix-

Having used my 5m Element for foiling I can verify that is true. The 7m Element also works reasonably well UNLESS the wind backs off substantially then it has a tendency to NOT want to stay up. I tried my 13m Element once when everybody else was on 9's and 12's foiling and it simply wouldn't stay up. That's really why I'm looking for something in the 7 to 12m range. I guess what I'm saying, is that it is critical that the kite will still fly when it is not completely powered. This has never been an issue for me when surfing with the Elements but has when foiling as you always drop at least one kite size and tend to fly in lighter conditions than the kite was originally designed for.
Switch Element v6 5m
Switch Helium v3 7m, 9m, 12m
Jerome D
felix
Posts: 544
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:24 pm

Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:43 am

We will have smaller Heliums available first 1/4 of 2018 that will tick that box.
Regards
Felix.
SwitchGreg
Posts: 53
Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2016 3:24 am

Sat Nov 18, 2017 8:15 am

I have just come home from my first foiling session with the Helium 2 15.5 The wind was about 8-12 knots.

In short, it was pure joy. The kite is a sky hook. It just hangs in the sky and lets you do whatever you like underneath. Nothing was difficult. All transitions were fun and easy. When necessary it turned fast and was quick through the window.

It does get a touch overpowered when cutting upwind, but normal kite control techniques work just fine to regain control. It's actually nice to be overpowered in light wind. You can do anything you want with very little risk of swimming in.

I think the fashion for single/no strut kites for light wind is a bit silly. A lightweight three strut kite works just fine. It's easier to design and build, it flies really well in a wide range of conditions, and it floats.
snalberski
Posts: 64
Joined: Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:10 am

Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:32 am

SwitchGreg wrote:I have just come home from my first foiling session with the Helium 2 15.5 The wind was about 8-12 knots.

In short, it was pure joy. The kite is a sky hook. It just hangs in the sky and lets you do whatever you like underneath. Nothing was difficult. All transitions were fun and easy. When necessary it turned fast and was quick through the window.

It does get a touch overpowered when cutting upwind, but normal kite control techniques work just fine to regain control. It's actually nice to be overpowered in light wind. You can do anything you want with very little risk of swimming in.

I think the fashion for single/no strut kites for light wind is a bit silly. A lightweight three strut kite works just fine. It's easier to design and build, it flies really well in a wide range of conditions, and it floats.
Have you even tried an Ultra? With a 9m Ultra and 20m normal lines I'm foiling at 11knts, with no fear of not being able to relaunch. With 32m race lines I expect to be able to get as low as 8 or 9knts. Number of struts IS less critical than the actual weight of the kite in my opinion but I would be suprised if a 15m Helium is as light as a 9m Ultra. I was originally thinking a 3 strut kite would be easier to relaunch than a single strut but found not having a strut at the wing tip allows the kite to roll off the water more easily. In addition to an 8knt low end potential the Ultra allows me to foil in as much as 20knts comfortably and TT in upto 25 knts.I never would have believed it but one kite for 8-25knts (actual non imagined marketing spin) is remarkable. It hangs in the air no matter what, ignoring stupid flying mistakes...kiting for dummies.
SwitchGreg
Posts: 53
Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2016 3:24 am

Sun Nov 19, 2017 4:29 am

I haven't tried the Ultra or any of the other reduced strut designs. They're all too expensive. I bought a Helium 2 and a bar for less than half the cost of any of the name brand kites.

I have ridden with people who are on reduced strut kites. They generally end up swimming. I very much believe that it's the kite operator that makes the difference, not the specific kite. For years I had high performance kites, now I've got Elements. The Elements lack a little bottom end compared to my old kites but I can make them work just fine. I'm still riding around having fun while other people are walking or swimming with kites two sizes larger.

I know about the idea of using small kites with foils, and to an extent I agree with it. I have always used a 7m as my go to foiling kite, and now can be riding with my 5m while other people are struggling. Ultimately it's all BS. It is much better to be properly powered. Transitions and foot changing and boosting are all much easier with ample power.

When your foiling skills develop it is much easier to handle more power than you thought you could. Eventually you learn to choose whatever power profile you want for the type of riding you're going to do. Tiny kite for slashing waves, big kite for blasting along in glass.

There was always an undercurrent that the Helium 2 was too big and too slow to use for foiling. I went with my instincts and found it works just fine. It is a pity that people hold off getting a kite that perfectly fits the bill for light wind foiling just because people are getting excited about reduced strut kites.

I will certainly look at a single strut Switch kite when they eventually become available. In the meantime I will happily use what I can buy and have fun with.
JeromeD
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:05 pm

Sun Nov 19, 2017 4:51 pm

I have also tried my 15.5 Helium when my 13m Element would not stay up for foiling. While it worked, I was nervous about being on that big a kite when everybody else was on 12’s and 9’s, fearing I would be major overpowered if the winds came up. So maybe a 12m Helium would be the solution? Now what to do for 7-9m?

My goal is to not to foil at Mach 10. I ate an awful lot of s**t learning to foil, so much so that I developed double vision that lasted for 4 months. While I’m now past that learning curve, I simply can’t afford more high speed crashes. That’s why my emphasis on kites that will fly in lower winds and not severely penalize me when the winds pick up.
Switch Element v6 5m
Switch Helium v3 7m, 9m, 12m
Jerome D
Alysum
Posts: 128
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2014 10:31 pm
Location: Sydney/France

Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:47 pm

The Element are great kites but too heavy for very light wind foiling.

I do hope the monostrut project happens in smaller sizes. Look at the Cloud strut less kites, all foil riders are going crazy on them.
E5 7m, E3 9m, H3 12m & Reo 9m
Brett
Posts: 70
Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 8:24 am

Mon Nov 20, 2017 10:13 pm

After waiting for a long time for a switch mono strut for light wind I bought a 13.4m BRM Cloud kite that weighs 2.3kg, the same as my 5m switch element so it hangs in the air better than any 3 strut kite ever can. I'm still hopeful switch will release a mono strut 4-12m for foiling soon as North, Airush, LF, Naish all have successful mono strut models.
topmick
Posts: 164
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2015 10:04 am
Location: Australia

Tue Nov 21, 2017 12:50 am

How about a lighter Element?, I've had a Cloud kite (12m) - was great in light wind but useless once the wind picked up. Also a bitch to relaunch if you dropped it in the water.
I think the struts (3) have a big influence on turning speed, they help twist the wing tips.
Mono strutt,s are better to relaunch but imo still don't perform as good as a nice "light" 3 strutt would.
I've heard good reports of the Reo as a foil kite.
PS, I'm not a foiler.
Post Reply